Big new boats on the way!!!

[Nobby Diesel]

About time too......

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/rtrs/20070725/tuk-uk-britain-carriers-fa6b408.html

Being built by UK companies too.

[Rhino]

Good news, anyone want to have a sweepstake on how much overbutget it will go?

[Steve Pyro]

It's about time the RN had proper aircraft carriers again rather than those Harrier ski ramp jobs.

[Leftie]

It's about time the RN had proper aircraft carriers again rather than those Harrier ski ramp jobs.

Steve, I'll think you'll find that although the Carriers are bigger, they still have the 'ski ramp' at the front.

Good news for Pompey and the remaining shipbuilding industry.  it's just a pity it's a French design!!!!!

[Perdu]

Its just a shame they don't still have Harriers too, to fly off those lumps of fossilised steel tied up in Pompey.

Broke my heart seeing them tied up and unwanted. Twenty five years or so old is nothing for a ship, is it? Ask HMS Victory, parked just round the corner from them.

[mgmark]

I think that an overspend and time overrun can be virtually guaranteed....all neatly adding to the already large hole in the defence budget. 

The dear old Harrier will almost certainly be out of service by the time the first carrier hits the water, and whilst there's no replacement yet, as JSF is being built by Lockheed Martin, I suspect we'll get them well before the floating airfields....

The names are suitably royal and deferential, but whatever happened to using good old inspiring carrier names like Illustrious, Ark Royal, Invincible etc etc....

MG Mark

[John Boy]

The last I heard the CVF was going to be built with ski jumps, but with an option to remove and fit catapults, as the final design of the JSF was still a bit in limbo.  The version of the JSF that needs the ski jump has trouble taking off fully loaded as its too heavy.

Notice that they don't fully admit that they will be using the Thales design, as the Big and Expensive (BAe) design was rubbish   

[Perdu]

I think that an overspend and time overrun can be virtually guaranteed....all neatly adding to the already large hole in the defence budget. 

The dear old Harrier will almost certainly be out of service by the time the first carrier hits the water, and whilst there's no replacement yet, as JSF is being built by Lockheed Martin, I suspect we'll get them well before the floating airfields....

The names are suitably royal and deferential, but whatever happened to using good old inspiring carrier names like Illustrious, Ark Royal, Invincible etc etc....

MG Mark

What happened?

Well they cant reuse them whilst the originals are still hanging around can they?

If the JSF is going to be in service before the "Redouteable" and the "CDG" or whatever the EU decide to name them after they take over the Royal Navy and RAF (not much Army left to play with now is there?) They can probably fly them off the real Invincible, Ark Royal and Illustrious which may still be OK with a fresh coat of paint. I mean look how tiddly HMS Belfast looks from afar.

[Matt Harper]

WTF is a JSF?

[Perdu]

I believe it is something called a "Joint Strike Fighter"

Has VTOL and Viffing and is supposed to be not only a bit stealthy but also a bit dangerous and nasty in attack and defence...


We used to have a programme called P1154 in the late sixties early seventies...



However, I digress.

 

[Leftie]

I think that an overspend and time overrun can be virtually guaranteed....all neatly adding to the already large hole in the defence budget. 

The dear old Harrier will almost certainly be out of service by the time the first carrier hits the water, and whilst there's no replacement yet, as JSF is being built by Lockheed Martin, I suspect we'll get them well before the floating airfields....

The names are suitably royal and deferential, but whatever happened to using good old inspiring carrier names like Illustrious, Ark Royal, Invincible etc etc....

MG Mark

Names of 'warships' have always been 'inspirational' and create a following outside of the RN.  Take HMS's Sheffield, Coventry and Manchester as an example. Their 'Home Cities' are proud of them. On the non city based, Fearless, Albion, Bulwark, Hood, Vanguard etc.  Very Proud and very inspirational names.

We aleady have a QE2 & QM.  But PoW was also a famous and powerfull ship from eons ago.

God bless all who sail in then (eventually).

Regarding the Harrier's, The 'rights' were sold to the yanks who still build them and are always updating them. The Marine Corps think they are the bees knees.  What do we do, stop building them!!

These are awesome aircraft and we should be modifying/updating/building them still. These are ideal for sea based operations and in fact for any small operational areas.

Bloody governments, remember the TSR2?

[John Boy]

They can probably fly them off the real Invincible, Ark Royal and Illustrious which may still be OK with a fresh coat of paint.

Unfortuantely not.  The current carriers are tiny, and were originally LPHs (Landing Platform Helicopter), a bit like the current HMS Ocean.  They were retrofitted with the ski jump later in life.

Rumour has it, at one point in the design programme cost saving attempts mean that the CVF flight deck was shortened so much the JSF couldn't take off.  Then it was realised it was shorter than the CDG, which just won't do.  Its suspected that somewhere in the design docs its written in stone "the CVF shall be at least one inch longer than any french equivalent".   

[Dobbo]

About time too indeed! I was working on CVF as early as 2004 when I was at BAE. Quite a few people relieved that 3 years work isn’t down the pan I imagine. When I was still there the plan was to assemble the ‘super blocks’ at the different yards (BAE in Glasgow & VT in Portsmouth) and then float them round to Rosyth in Edinburgh.

For a look at the JSF go and see the terrible new Die Hard movie as it features for about 5 minutes near the end. Quite funny as it hasn’t passed safety of flight yet!

[Perdu]

" The current carriers are tiny, and were originally LPHs (Landing Platform Helicopter), a bit like the current HMS Ocean.  They were retrofitted with the ski jump later in life."

Not quite John boy, it was Hermes that was retrofitted with the ski jump, the Harrier carriers were built in that configuration, which is a damned good thing because the good old Illustrious was able to be a vital part of the Falklands Taskforce.

But yes they were originally intended to be chopper carriers but the Navalised Harrier received some Government recognition at just the right time to disperse a huge political storm for ... (guess which Governing Party)


Peter we have another good debate again huh!

I suppose it will be good to have some stealth in the air in the future, but why destroy our own production base this way? What a bunch of clowns...

[Rhino]

Didn't the labour goverment who originally said there was no need for aircraft carriers, thus the old Ark Royal was scrapped. They then realised they were wrong and introduced through deck cruisers hey presto The Invincible class.