Just let F1 die!

[Abs]

I agree - Let F1 die, but the money and evil pixie bernie will go else where - Sportscars ?

I'd rather see Bernie doing well in F1, it means he won't be looking elsewhere for something to screw up especially sportscars..

[Fax]

Dave,
Yeah your right, there is more to being a F1 driver than I let on, he has to be able to give a good press conference these days.  Time was when a F1 driver was judged by his ability to balance a GP car on the throttle, now he's judged by his PR potential.   I've followed Grand Prix racing since 1970, I ate, slept and breathed F1.  Sorry but what I saw this weekend wasn't GP racing.  It was loud and colorful and I have no idea what it was but it sure as hell wasn't a Grand Prix meeting.
Saveloy,
Agreed,
If Il Grande John had been able to swallow his pride in 1966 he would have many more GP wins and world titles to his name.  His talent deserves more than his single F1 title.
John

[Chris24]

Americans just DONT understand....its like football - or "soccer" - the most beautiful game in the world - but yet, Americans still argue that FOOTball is played with your hands......

Hey, the most beautiful game in the world is played with your hands. RUGBY LEAGUE ! Not that football crap ! Closely followed by Ice Hockey (again played with your hands or rather a big stick !)

[Matt Harper]

Can anyone find Fax a soap box to stand on!  

At least Fax has an opinion.... I've been enjoying and contributing to this forum for several years, just to qualify the following.
I didn't bother signing-in, since I got back from France, as nobody seemed to have anything even slightly interesting to say, other than to report how arseholed they got, how much fun it was to draw on each other and how many banal yellow stickers they applied to people's person or property, whether they liked it or not.
Well done Fax, for re-introducing healthy debate, hopefully replacing all this chat-room bollocks.
Personally, I too believe that F1 is a snore - but the reality is that it sells. Sponsors, TV companies, advertisers and punters on the gate buy it. I think it is still the biggest TV sport on the planet, so it's tough to argue against it's continued popularity. As with most forms of motor racing - it is better value on TV than for real and as a global product, it is marketed quite well. Ecclestone might be unpopular with fans in the purest sense, but he didn't get to be a billionaire by accident. The little sh*t knows how to peddle F1.
Like others have stated, F1 is cyclic. Schumi is supremely talented (if devoid of a personality that the common man can relate to) and there will be others just like him.
My gripe with F1 is that the technology in the car means the driver is less able to display inate, seat of the pants, hair raising nerve and daring and skill - because the car won't let him.
F1 is in danger of becoming like aeroplane racing.
As a side note, the American motor racing experience is different to the European version, only in that it is more widespread, accessible, fan-friendly (F1 excepted), better value and more varied. US race fans are highly knowlegeable and just as committed. I'm not sure what the basis for the comment about American fans, "just not understanding" is - pure ignorance, I suspect.    

[jpchenet]

Welcome back Matt!!  

Just for the record, FatLad has been a lurker for some time, attending Le Mans several times with Abs and The Pie Eaters and having shared more than a few drinks with him at this year's race I'm pretty sure I can safely say his comment to John was intended as being tongue in cheek. He doesn't have a malicious bone in his body (and there's a lot of it to fill !!   )

Unfortunatley as we have seen several times on here the cold communication of typing can perhaps lose it's humourous intentions.

[Steve Pyro]

As a side note, the American motor racing experience is different to the European version, only in that it is more widespread, accessible, fan-friendly (F1 excepted), better value and more varied.

True Matt, but there's plenty of minority motorsport in the UK and Europe that caters for the fan and not the sponsor (probably because they don't have many).

Take UK stock car racing, drag racing, sprint events and the like and your average Joseph Public is welcome to wander around the pit area, chat to the competitors, see the cars close up and generally have a pretty enjoyable day without shelling out a big wad of cash.

These are the kind of events I enjoy the most, the grass roots of UK motorsport where you don't feel compelled to buy an expensive t-shirt or baseball cap and the toilet facilities are lovingly ramshackled.

Glad you had a good LM Matt, missed you at the circuit, maybe I'll be over for Sebring or Gatornationals and Garlits Museum one day.

[Ballast]

Thanks JPC.

As you rightly say the comment was intended as tongue in cheek. Apologies fax if I caused any offense, I can assure you that none was intended.  

[BigH]

Wahaaayy!!
That's more like it!
Like it or not, and I disagree with Fax and Robbo on this, Schumacher is probably the best driver sitting in a cockpit today, and has been for a long time. There is simply no other explanation for the results he gets, his record speaks for itself. Fax, we've had (what I understand to be) some of the best open wheel pilots come into F1 from the US, and no-one really has given MS a consistent hard time. Ok, it's difficult to gauge without a common yardstick of identical cars, but in equal machinery, I don't think anyone would touch him. He's the whole package. I saw him at LM driving the Merc, as a teenager I think, and the guy was mesmerising, standing out from the rest like the proverbial donkeys undercarriage. I suspect there's a little bit of xenophobia going on here, after all, he's German, the worst kind of foreigner...
It's a bit tough calling him a monster. Who here actually knows the guy? I for one would be pretty keen to keep some space between the real me and the media men, being a global personality can't be a complete psychological cakewalk. He's a competitive professional sportsman, and he gets the job done, remarkably well if you ask me.
The problem lies with the cars, I'm not sure it's about the rest of the teams getting their act together (FS), some of the cars already seem to be pretty close to the red'uns, the point is, whoever gets in front, stays there, the aerodynamics and brakes just won't allow conventional overtaking. The rules need to change, instead of the driver strapping himself in at the start, pressing a button, and hanging on like grim death for an hour and a half, let's have some human involvement, and thus more opportunities to make mistakes. You know, manual gear changes, a clutch to control traction, that sort of thing. I think Mosley and his mates have lost the plot, their judgement is clouded by the sheer vastness of the sums of money involved, and the focus is no longer on motor racing.
But Fax, I'm with you on this partisan bollocks. Schumacher/Montoya, Arsenal/Man Utd. etc , for f*cks sake, anyone with a grain of intelligence should be able to enjoy the sport for what it is. Fashion victims if you ask me.
Back to handpainting the ticklers...
H

[Matt Harper]

Thanks JPC.

As you rightly say the comment was intended as tongue in cheek. Apologies fax if I caused any offense, I can assure you that none was intended.  

Can't speak for Fax - but I wasn't at all concerened about the 'soapbox' comment - fair play. My point was that he had an interesting viewpoint in amongst the mire of crap that's been posted of late!

Hi Steve - sorry too, that I missed you at the track. Not to worry - you really should do your best to experience Sebring - it's a very special event (clashes with Gatornats however, which is piss-poor planning on someone's part).
I have nostaglic memories about the accessibility of 'club' meetings in UK - all shattered when I was over in UK in May and went to the BTCC meet at Oulton Park. Even with pit creds, the never-ending stream of officious arseholes, playing God for the day, got on my tits after a while.

Aye-up Harry. Eloquent and stylish as ever - this thread has raised the bar - heartfelt opinion, healthy debate and even a bit of name-calling - makes it all a bit more interesting than "I've been twaited".

[jpchenet]

You came to the UK to the BTCC and din't arrange for us to meet up with you Matt???  Shame on you!!!  

Working towards Sebring at the moment. Was looking at the Petit but dates clash with family commitments!!

[rcutler]

Hi Mat,

Nice to see you back. I am not good with memory and unfortunately due to injuries I didn't see as much of the race this year as I would have liked. All the postings will probably smarten themselves up in the next week as people slide away for the winter . I for sure will be about untill the internet use at work is banned and will head down with a few of us to the Classic in a few weeks time and will certainly follow up on the event in a serious light. I originally got interested in GT racing after F1 got boring with the same win and the unreliabilty of the cars near the back of the field. Now with the reliability being fixed although there is no contest for first place there is often a good scrap at the mid to back of the field. This year at Le Mans I was over the moon at the chase for first in LMP1 and the first for GTS. Great racing. I also enjoyed my first hilclimb were I met Wishywashyman and Junior and Pretzl, this is another great UK sporting event with just thousants of a second between positions. Friendly and Fun atmosphere. I do hope you take no offence to any of my fun posts which I do not put in a thread untill I believe the original topic has been resolved.

As you can probably see we are both just off being YabbGODS a tribute to both of us. Where about in the states are you?? I have a two week break in august near Boston and would like to see some racing if possible.

[Fax]

First off, well done to everyone that voiced their opinion. I was amazed at how quickly this thread took off.  I suppose it's a good sign that people feel this strongly about the subject.  Fatlad, no offence taken.  It wouldn't be the first time on this forum its been suggested that Americans just don't get it and I'm pretty sure it won't be the last.  If everyone on this forum agreed about everything it would be pretty damn boring.  I'm headed up to Mid-Ohio this weekend, soapbox in hand, to watch the ALMS kick off their summer campaign.
Fax

[Steve Pyro]

Matt, sad to hear of your experiences with BTCC.

I recall we had a postings 'session' a while back regarding Santa Pod and other drag race sites within the UK.

You'll be pleased to know the old corrugated urinal block has been removed and now replaced by a brick built facility.
The track still seems to be locked in the 70's though.  I don't know what the arrangements for spectators are in the US but the Pod still has a big mound of earth to stand on piled up on one side of the track and some very second hand tiered seating probably from a circus tent on the other side.

The race fan can casually wander from the pile of earth, around the rear of the strip, to the pit side and nose about to their heart's content at the cars / bike / racers.  Some 'top' teams have bought a tensor barrier to keep you from putting your sticky mits on the slicks but most welcome a bit of banter and enquiry.

Bearing in mind the value of the cars and tools laying around, there is no obvious security or heavy handed pit gorillas.  Some teams may have some self produced t-shirts for sale, the more enterprising ones sell smashed valves, pistons and the occassional engine block.

Last year I went to Ipswich's Foxhall Stadium to see the Ipswich Witches speedway racing.  The track was like walking back in time 20 years - and I loved it.

These, and more, are some of the reasons I ENJOY minority motorsport and would rather mow the grass than watch Mike and his pals tootle around a scaletrix track on Sunday afternoon.


(my Easter 2004 Santa Pod photos here - http://community.webshots.com/album/154821656CSvUEo )

[Matt Harper]

You came to the UK to the BTCC and din't arrange for us to meet up with you Matt???  Shame on you!!!  

Working towards Sebring at the moment. Was looking at the Petit but dates clash with family commitments!!

Hi Mark - I was only there 4 days - all work, with the Sunday at Oulton watching the boss's lad crashing out of the F Renault race on lap one!
Both Sebring and Petit Le Mans are the dog's knob - Sebring bigger - Road Atlanta is somewhat easier to do logistically and is closer (timewise)


Hello Rick
Don't get me wrong - I'm no 'purist' - idle banter is great (if it's amusing) - I'm sure you're correct - the activity on this forum will settle somewhat, now that the main event is behind us - it needs to be kept funny in my opinion. I do like a good ol' fashioned verbal punch-up though!
I live in Orlando FL (awful, but someone has to, I guess) Not sure about race action in the Baaaaaston area - I'm sure Fax will clue you up!

[Steve Pyro]

Not sure about race action in the Baaaaaston area - I'm sure Fax will clue you up!

Watkins Glens 'close' by - well, 300 miles close by.