Sebring 2013

[Kristof]

[Kristof]

[Maximum]

Nice Pic of Turn 10.

[gatordad]

Well, we are up this beautiful morning at Sebring and the weather is perfect.  Not a cloud and temps headed to 75.  The cars are warmed up and the anticipation is high.  Based on nascar's history, this very well could be the last great sports car race at this track.  Enjoy it fans! 

[lofty]

lovin the viper corvette race and the new aero double end plate on the no 2 audi.4 hours to go.
kristof great pics from quali

[gatordad]

Just back from Sebring.  Great weather and better GT racing.  The crowd seemed to be a bit smaller this year from previous races but they were shown a very exciting event.  The Audi's are just plain wicked looking and bulletproof in their execution.  Joest does such a wonderful job in preparation.  I wouldn't bet against them for LM unless the hothead gets aboard and puts one in the wall again.  To see six different males of cars in Gt and to see them all being pretty competitive gives me a warm spot for the future of racing.  Now I'm home and just turned on the NASCAR race at Bristol.  this used to be the toughest ticket in racing but now the stands are empty and there are canvas coverings over the whole top tier of the track.

We will need to see how the "brains" at NASCREW will come in and "fix" this race.  Rumor I heard was that they want to pave the front straight so all the bumps go away...what a really stupid thing to do as that is a huge part of the appeal of the track.  We laa agreed to wait and see.  Then when the reserved space renewal arrives we will come down to the track to see what they are doing to make it better.

Where else can you see an 8 cylinder piece of Detroit's finest pounding it out against a 12 cylinder piece of art from Italy for hours at a time while a 6 cylinder engineering masterpiece from Germany rides close behind in case there is a screwup by either of the two cars ahead?  Come on people, it doesn't get much better than that, does it?

Save Sebring from the idiots from Daytona Beach!

[Boorish Grobian]

Why are you watching Bristol?  The Daytona 200 is on!
I can see why they would want to pave the front straight, from a purist perspective the bumps are part of Sebring folklore, but the way the front stretch pulls apart during the race is pretty dangerous.  By the end of the race all of the patches have pulled out, and there's some damn big holes in track.
The GT race was entertaining, but the LMP races were barely a blip on the radar.  Sadly that's been the story of ALMS in recent years, hence the reason it's being swallowed up by the bunch on Speedway Blvd.  Much of the ALMS's demise has been self-inflicted, starting with amaturish managment.  I don't have any idea what NASCAR's long term plans for United Sportscar are, but its been pretty clear from the past three or four season's that things couldn't go on the way they were.
On TV it did look like the crowd was down considerably, another sign that things are not well.
Fax

[gatordad]

Well, you weren't there, so that's one.

Just tuned into Bristol to see the crowd. 

I've been going to Sebring for quite a few years and the real appeal is the access for us and the bupms in sunset to the front straight, imo.

No sense in in discussing it.  they will do what they want and we can vote with our $$...or not.

[Boorish Grobian]

I've got quite a few Sebring 12hrs in person myself, I get the atmoshpere, the history, etc.  Trust me, there's nobody on this forum that's more into the history, and tradition of the sport than I am.  My comments were looking at it from a safety standpoint,  I can see where they think it might need a facelift.  I've walked down the pit straight at Sebring many times after the race ended, and I wouldn't want to ride a bicycle down it.  I think a solid idea would be to pave most of it, and leave a strip of the old cement at the start-finish, similar to what they did at IMS with the bricks.  Sometimes circuits do need to be updated with the times.
It doesn't matter what NASCAR does there, or rolls out for cars, the fans will still show up, hell in '74 they showed up even though there wasn't a race.
I was just kidding about Bristol, I'm a bike guy so putting in a plug for AMA guys.
Fax

[gatordad]

My first Sebring was 1958...Stirling Moss in a birdcage M!

Missed a few during Viet Nam and the 20 years after it but have been a loyal fan ever since.

I was born in Daytona Beach.  My dad was great friends with Marshall Teague and Smokey Yunick.

Used to love the 36 hours of Florida.  Destroyed the engine and tranny at Daytona and then junked the rest of the car at Sebring.

Who knows.  I just love racing and really don't like the DP's.  That's all...

[Boorish Grobian]

I'm with ya, I think all of us are in agreement that DP's are not the answer.  Its a tough puzzle to solve, we love the high tech LMP1 cars, but then you have conpanies like Audi come in and spend everyone into oblivion, and the result is what we've had in the ALMS for the past several years, very thin proto grids.  I also despise the Audi approach of showing up for one or two races a year over here, and then leaving the series high & dry the rest of the calendar.  With the DP's, they're loud & physical, but they're not a true protoype, very much along the lines of how NASCAR goes racing, spaceframe chassis, big V8's, lots of beating & banging, but not true sportscar racing.
I don't have the time in you've got, but I've been around.  Started with Can-Am and Trans-Am in 1971, been a regular at places like Mid Ohio, Road Atlanta, and The Glen ever since, for everything from Can-Am, Trans-Am, F5000, IMSA, CART to the AMA Supers, and vintage bikes.  I'm a veteran of forty Indianapolis 500's, made seven trips over to Le Mans, a bunch of GP's (both two and four wheeled) a couple of Daytona 500's and about nine trips to the spring Cup race at Talladega, and countless days & nights at midwest bullrings like Eldora and Winchester (we're going up to Eldora next month to see the USAC Sprinters).
Fax

[Lazy B'stard]

It's going to be interesting to see what tech regs they come up with. The GT class is fantastic, and so just needs stability. Prototypes are a bit if a nightmare to work out though. It needs to be somewhere between the blue collar Daytona Prototype, and the hi tech of the LMP1/2 cars. Either way, it's going to mean the building of new cars, and that's expensive at any time never mind it these days of austerity.

So how about having a loose set of regulations? Teams spend millions finding a tiny aero advantage, when an extra 1000cc under the hood costs little. Yes folks, I'm looking back at CAN AM. Let teams build prototypes. A manufacturer will still want to showcase its efficient diesel technology, it's hybrid technology, it's ultra light technology..... But we could also get Texan Chicken farmers shoving enormous V8s into a tube chassis special and dishing out some whup ass. Call it an open class, and see what turns up. The reason GT is a success is that it's relativly low tech and comparatively affordable to be competetive. Front engine, rear engine, mid engine, 6,8,10,12 cylinders, yet they are all evenly matched. You don't need a set of regs so tight it almost becomes a spec formula to make for close racing.

Not  everyone is going to be happy when the regs come out. Everyone has their own agenda. So focus on the fans. Give them something exciting to watch. Get the grandstands packed, get the TV ratings up, only then will the series prosper.

[Grand_Fromage]

I see where you are going with the 'loose regs' route, and I agree with your aims. The trouble with sketchy regs is that it makes it even easier for a manufacturer to waltz in and 'buy' the series. Loose rules would work it they were only loose for privateers... but then you have a puzzle to solve with what you do with factory teams.

Organizing a race series is a very delicate balancing act. The book of sporting regulations is  only one element. Endurance racing and sports car racing are particularly European beasts, and are not a natural fit on US tracks... but that is the whole attraction. Like a dog riding a bicycle, the wonder is not that it is done well, but that it is done at all. European sports GTs and prototypes are seen as a bit exotic and exciting, and to have them on US circuits is an attraction to a certain (some would say better informed) group of race fans.

Don Panoz, almost by dumb luck, hit upon a winning formula in the ALMS. By bringing the flavour of Le Mans to North America, it chimed with race fans of a certain age who miss the 'glory days of old', and welcomed the rebirth of a real endurance racing series in their home country.  I'm not sure that the France empire understand that fact. The choice of a racing helmet for the logo of the new series highlights that misunderstanding. As we all know, at Le Mans drivers are essential, but the car is the star.

It's going to be interesting to see what tech regs they come up with. The GT class is fantastic, and so just needs stability. Prototypes are a bit if a nightmare to work out though. It needs to be somewhere between the blue collar Daytona Prototype, and the hi tech of the LMP1/2 cars. Either way, it's going to mean the building of new cars, and that's expensive at any time never mind it these days of austerity.

So how about having a loose set of regulations? Teams spend millions finding a tiny aero advantage, when an extra 1000cc under the hood costs little. Yes folks, I'm looking back at CAN AM. Let teams build prototypes. A manufacturer will still want to showcase its efficient diesel technology, it's hybrid technology, it's ultra light technology..... But we could also get Texan Chicken farmers shoving enormous V8s into a tube chassis special and dishing out some whup ass. Call it an open class, and see what turns up. The reason GT is a success is that it's relativly low tech and comparatively affordable to be competetive. Front engine, rear engine, mid engine, 6,8,10,12 cylinders, yet they are all evenly matched. You don't need a set of regs so tight it almost becomes a spec formula to make for close racing.

Not  everyone is going to be happy when the regs come out. Everyone has their own agenda. So focus on the fans. Give them something exciting to watch. Get the grandstands packed, get the TV ratings up, only then will the series prosper.

[TDDWEST]

The "WFO"  Crew in the Zoo, would like to thank all those who came across the pond to say hello and lift a glass and toast the great event that is "The 12 Hours of Sebring"!

[Boorish Grobian]

There is a rich history of sportscar racing in the US, but it has always been very much a niche sport, rarely gets any mainstream media exposure.
It's occured to me that when the sport has been at its healthiest over here, is when there's been little manufacturer involvment.  The best example of a big make coming in and killing a series was Can-Am.  Even during its glory days, despite the fact that the works McLaren's usually scooped the hardware, a privateer could purchase a Mclaren or Lola, and take on the might of the Kiwi's, and occasionally knock them off.  When Porsche came in with its cost-no-object 917 turbo, the cost of being competitve went through the roof, a cost most privateers couldn't afford, and the series died.
I loved the early days of the ALMS, when you had huge grids of privateer Ferrari 333sp's, R&S's, etc.  I've just never bought into the idea that one needs big manufacturer involvment for a series to have credibility.
Fax