Club Arnage

I seems that once again the stewards have messed up, and yet again it seems to be in Ferrari's favour. I have twice watched the lap where Alonso alledgidly blocked Massa and can't see anthing wrong with it. I would say that Massa even benifited from Alonso's slipstream.

Is the FIA trying to manipulate the outcome of the drivers championship so it runs to the last race? or even worse engineering a last championship for Spoonface.

For once I agree with The Cock, F1 is corrupt and it dosn't seem to care who knows it.

Even more reason not to watch it. Another nail in the F1 coffin methinks

Well at least an F1 driver has now said what we have all known for ages "Formula One is no longer a sport" - thanks Fernando but you caught on a bit late didn't you.

Still, at least that bloody german's on his way out. At times in the past it has seemed that the balance of opinion has been uncommonly skewed towards him.

There are many people in and around F1 who would gladly suck the farts out of his arse. I do not count myself among them.

The accusation that the season is being stage managed seems fairly plausible. I don't like that. I like proper competition.

That's it. I'm off to watch professional wrestling.

Anyone see Mad Max interviewed in the pre-race pit lane interview with Martin Brundle? Martin quizzed him over the incident and really let him know his opinions, both as a driver and a commentator.

Nice to see Max actually bothering to turn up for one of his events though. I suspect that's cos of the post-race announcements that are due.

Yes, good old Martin.  Also, full marks to Flavio B, "Will we miss Michael?" "No, I won't miss him at all."  Join the club.

Another classic from The Cock, "Now that Alonso has stopped, Kubica, who has been in a podium position since the start, moves up to third place" ??? ??? ???

In an odd way Mr Schumacher will be missed, I doubt if any of us will ever see such an all out racer as he ever again.  At least it looks like he will have a role within Ferrari for next season.

The time with Senna and JM Balestre springs to mind :-\

A very odd way.
 Have to say, Kubica was stunning - pity he was overshadowed by all the Schuey stuff.  In a perfect world of course he'd race in proper cars...

Flavio has forgotten who brought the championship twice to his outfit.

I almost can't remember Formula1 without M. Schumacher (due to age ;) ) so in some sort of way I will mis his appearence. But let'S see what happens next year without him around on the track.

Surely you can remember the second half of '99?
Laughed my ass of with Salo, brilliant bloke ;D

Yeh 1999, I'm sure that Ferrari could have won the championship with Irve the Swerve if they wanted to but being as they were paying Schumi megebugs they defered the winning until 2000

Kubiscuit was fast, but the newbies normally have a few fast runs then fizzle, button was like that with Williams and then 106 races later he wins a race.

F1 has been the "business of motor racing" for at least the last 7 or 8 years and probably for a while before that I'd guess. 

Are Bernie et al pulling the strings?  I honestly don't know but at times it looks very much like it.   

They do now run at least one permanent steward at all races (it might even be a permanent team (3) - I can't remember?)  so in theory there should be some consistency in the decisions that are made.

Do we know whether the Stewards investigated the Alonso infringement off their own back or whether the red team protested? 

Good point FS.  On the surface he seems a little less larey that some of the talented newcomers of the past but then so did Button.  We shall see (if I continue to bother to watch this shower, that is!)  Hav a look at thishttp://sport.guardian.co.uk/columnists/story/0,,1869561,00.html So bang-on.

I understand there is one permanent steward, one from the local track and a third.  The third guy this time was from South America but had suspiciously Italian name!

From what I recall during the commentary the third man's first name was Enzo. No connection with a certain Italian racing outfit there then.........

Flavio is now saying that his comments were meant to be a joke.
Sounds like the powers that be, have put the frighteners on him.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/5339006.stm

Now Alonso has joined the fray.

I wonder how many places on the grid this will move him back!

of course every other team and driver are the souls of discretion, follow the rules to the letter and don't try to find go fast loop holes ;)

Can't wait for the new season and hear Ron Dennis bitch about Ferrari's new driver, trying it on:D

Now, Now. We'll take your toys away children, if you can't play nicely together.

This is F1 Spidey, are you kidding?

If its not corrupt, its all very strange.  You couldn't afford to bribe Bernie, because he's made so much money out of F1.  I can't understand why Ferrari were quick up to 2004, slowed for no apparent reason in 2005, but are quick this year. 

Perhaps the deal was "its getting boring - you'll have to let someone else win in 2005 and you can win again in 2006, but you'll have to retire after that."  And 2006 went a bit wrong, so the Renaults had to be slowed down, and once Shuey knew he could win he retired.

It seems to fit

And since when was a mass damper (ie clever suspension that Renault in particular have used to their advantage this season) a moveable aerodynamic device?

f**k it. Like I said, I'm off to watch professional wrestling. A least that isn't rigged.

Why doesn't the FIA just make it a single chassis spec formula like CART or IRL?  I mean for all intents & purposes that's what its become.  For Christ's sake! When your bitching about things like flexing wings, mass damping and have a pressed wooden plank screwed to the underside of the car things have gone plain stupid.  Hell, even in NASCAR there's no lumber attached to the cars.  As I said before, NASCAR and F1 have become racing for people who don't know anything about racing.
Fax

Yeah but if F1 got their act together there would be no more Fax rants on the subject.  Which would be sad.

Oh Joy of Joy's ;)

This week's Autosport magazine is a bumper edition following Michael Schumacher's retirement announcement at the Italian GP. Along with a photographic tribute, read Martin Brundle's personal and exclusive analysis on the great man, plus all the details of what's next for Ferrari, and the controversy of an enthralling world title battle.

Didn't think it warranted a new thread,

 :D

Some of Brundle's thoughts were in The Thunderer today. Not entirely a Schuey fan, is he?

You mean Martin "I was just as fast as Senna in F3" Brundle? ;D
Doubt your going to hear much positive about Schumacher from any of his former teamates.
Except perhaps Irvine, and Brazilian Burst Into Tears Every Ten Minutes.
They both seemed quite content to follow Herr Schu around.
Fax

Fax you really do sway violently from talking sense to talking utter bolluc*s with alarming unpredictability...

The prospect of making F1 a single make category is completely and utterly ridiculous.  I was, but am no longer an F1 fan.  I do recognise its deficiencies but how on earth would it be possible to generate manufacturer participation in your scenario. The manufacturers would just recreate F1 elsewhere.

Brundle/Senna/F3... I spent a great many of my weekends watching that fascinating duel develop.  Early season results might suggest otherwise, but the latter half of the season is, in my opinion, a truer reflection of the respective drivers' pace.  In F3 he was at least as fast as Senna.

its a common trait on here, just go with the flow ;)

I know - I am sure some will think much the same about my contributions too...

Same here, don't think I've come across so many "correct" views about a single subject.  Just goes to show how diverse mother nature is ;)

Whaddya mean - mine are the only correct views!!! ;D

EXACTLEY :D

C'mon. Everybody on this site is right all the time - except when they're wrong of course.  (Loose translation - disagree with me.)

did I see that old dog FS flying the harrier in our international air display last week.. or was it Red 1?? ;)

Oh WOW someone who still reads Autosport  ;D

Hmmmh NO!  just get the odd e-mail from them, that's how I knowed about it ;)

Yeah yeah I believe you, your secret is safe with me  ;)

Oldtimer, I was being sarcastic regarding F1 being turned into a single chassis spec formula ;) My point being that the tech regs for F1 have become so restrictive that it effectively is a spec formula.  The cars are virtually identical by the nature of the regulations they're built to.  As for Brundle, Martin has spent a lot of time over the years sying he was as fast Senna in F3, agreed, he gave Senna a hard time in F3 In 1983, it didn't translate to F1 though.  Again, was being sarcastic.
Fax

John,
You haven't been rattling peoples cages again, have you? Perish the thought!

I suspect that there will be a renewed enthusiasm over here for F1 soon, when our very own Lewis Hamilton gets his drive.

I've only watched a few of the GP2 races, but this lad seems to have the credentials to make the step up to F1. Lets hope so.

All the same, I still won't be paying to watch him, as good as he may be.

ND

Hi Nobby, someone's got to do it.  A forum full of people in agreement is pretty fricking dull.
Oldtimer, you mentioned a manufacturers pullout, that would be the best thing to happen to F1.  For my money the less manufacturer interest, the better the racing.  If you look back to the sixties & seventies when there was very little big manfacturer involvment, the racing was fabulous, with big grids and opportunites for small budget teams to do well. The sport really went into the crapper when companies like Honda and Renault decided to try and spend everyone into oblivion.  Let them go and form their own series, it'll be just as boring as the made for TV crap the FIA feeds people now.  I've never bought into the idea for one second that having a bunch of big, cost no object companies invloved is a good thing for the sport.
Fax

Like Audi?

Fax - I agree with you on the point about quality of racing, but with the manufacturers would go the money and the media influence so the 'non-manaufacturer' formula would be marginalised - however good the racing itself.

The manufacturer, media and glamour circus would dust itself down, recreate F1 and the wider world would probably never hear another word about the 'better' category that had been created in parallel.

Its strange that unlike F1, the era's we best associate with great Sportscar teams and races are the ones with the strongest manaufacture presence, the late 60's when Ford spared no expense with the GT40 to rattle enzos cage, then when that era ended after Porsche, Ferrari, Alfa, Ford, Matra etc all had a turn at being best, Sportscar went into decline thur the 70's during which F1 started to grow into the monster it has now become.

We then had a wonderful time again with works teams from Porsche, Jag, Lancia, Merc, Nissan, Toyota etc all running in Grp C before it went tits up and since then dispite some brief returns with GT1's in the late 90's nothing to match them.

I guess works team should keep out of F1, leave that to the specialist small teams and stick to sportcars where they can promote there Brand without it being swamped in a wave of Shumi fever where most members of the public are not looking at what he drives but what he wears orhis latest hair care product.

Brundle against Senna in F3, Brundle could I think run with him from time to time, but was never on his level, and their respective F1 careers proved who could drive faster.
That does not change the fact that I think senna was a twat and did more to damage racing and created the racing ethos perfected by Schmacher. They where both however bloody fast drivers.

Oldtimer, once again let the money and media influence go.  Just fine with me, let the big manfacturers create their own seperate series.  Champ car racing over here has shown just how devastating trying to run two parallel series can be to the health of the sport.  Let them all cut their own throats and fall out of favor with the media darlings, the casual stick & ball fans, watch the TV and attendance ratings plummet, and have to start over.  As far as I'm concerned its the best thing that could happen to F1.
Nordic, agree with you regarding Brundle, fine sportscar driver and journeyman F1 driver.  Never looked remotely like being world champ material though. Was almost always overshadowed by his F1 teamates.
Fax

Shows you how much money F1 one has, i knew one designer who spent the whole year designing throttle linkage's, and another who only did the front top wishbone.
They were both bored shitless.
F1, more money now and less entertainment.

Semi-related:

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns17477.html

Interesting.....

I wonder how many more stories and truths will come out over the years to come about the 'greatness' of the Schumacher / Ferrari combo.

here are some interesting quotes from around the paddock http://www.itv-f1.com/Feature.aspx?Type=General&PO_ID=37268 before you start, I know they are from the cock shop ;)

Fawning bunch of bastards.

 I'm not a fan of DC but at least he has the bottle to mention spoonfaces race ethics.

Good riddance I say.

lets wait until next season and see if those words remain true ;)

I know I'm not as close to death as some of you guys  :D, so therefore can't remember when Fangio was racing, but I can't see there being another driver half as good as Schumi in my lifetime. It's a big loss to the sport, and it is still a sport thank you Mr Alonso.

Shame about the flying teddies though, I hoped our current world champion was more mature than that. Survey says XXX. Good luck with your McLoser car next season though eh.

Ello Bird, how's married life?

Schumacher entertains and infuriates in equal part but he can never be the greatest IMO despite what the record books say. If one was to write a 1950's Boys Own story about a so-called "typical" German bad egg, you know, the worst kind of foreigner; a liar, a cheat and a scoundrel with a massive chin, palid complexion and who says "for sure" at the end of every sentence, well he would be an absolute blue-print for such a character.

for sure.

Andy are you familiar with the chap? www.thechap.net

Here we go!  My opinion about TGF (as Kate calls him)
is the same as mine on Senna.  Schumacher will never be rated as a one of the greats as far as I'm concerned because of his on track ethics (or lack there of).
World titles and race wins don't mean squat to me.  What is the title "World Champion" worth anyway when it doesn't count the likes of Stirling Moss, Gilles Villeneuve, Ronnie Peterson, Dan Gurney, and Tony Brooks as title holders.  Its not about how much winning you've done, its the way it was done. ;)
Fax

Did someone mention Senna???? ;D

Any bets being taken as to whether Fernando will decide F1 is a sport again?

Do you often wonder if Bernie has a switch which nadgers a drivers chances?  Whats the chance now that Mr Schumacher wins in Brazil and Mr Alonso comes 9th? ;)

Don't give them bloody ideas. Bernies nobble - o - matic machine must be nearly worn out.