Club Arnage

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but...

Auntie Beeb is reporting that TVR have not renewed the lease at their Blackpool factory & have laid off over 25% of staff.  :-\

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4939224.stm

I seriously hope this turns out well, the last thing we need is more bad news for British industry!! They'd better find a new location in the UK & not move the factory over to Russia!! >:(  Otherwise I'll certainly not be buying myself a Sagaris, once I've got the cash!! ;)

Looks like they are prepareing the ground for bad news
http://www.pistonheads.com/tvr/index.asp?storyId=13760.

Tough news but if you carry on the business of making shoddily-produced ugly expensive useless plastic tubs that nobody wasnts, then really what do you expect? It all went off the rails with the current Tuscan. Hideous.

Yeh, you're ever the reallist Andy no room for sentiment I'm afraid.

Likewise, it's a shame when people lose their livlihood - but, I agree with Andrew (now there's a turn-up), TVR's are silly and in most cases (in my experience) the owners are tossers who buy them because they make a noise like an aeroplane.

The article i read says production is down to 2 a week!  Its not worth moving a factory to Russia at that rate.

This is not good news, worrying actually... anyone wants a half rotten 3000M ? Contact me through my profile. ;D No, just kidding, I'd never sell it.

No, really, this should be taken with a grain of salt (?). They went bankrupt so often.

IMO this is the Russian owners saying "how much do you want us" to the Government and the Developement Councils.....

Standard practice I understand in Eastern Europe.  You want us to stay you show us how much you want us......

Here l was thinking it was only me ::)shame but for the money theres a lot better out there ::)

My thoughts go more towards how it will effect the breakdown and recovery industry   ;D

I agree with the above, TVR's are rubbish and driven by people who in general are not my cup of tea.

But it would be a shame for another british car company to dissappear no matter how rubbish they are.

Here's a spy shot of the new TVR prototype under test at Farnborough.

More work required on the styling but a better looker than some of their more recent efforts. At least they've done away with the rubbish perspex spoiler on the Saggiarse which looks like it was lifted straight from a 1980's Barratt House bathroom.

I was there this week...There is still some light in the tunnel it seems...try your Dutch and enjoy...

http://forum.drinkingforholland.com/viewtopic.php?t=257

Bartus(who still hates the food there though)

Where?  Blackpool?!!  :o

Interesting pics Bartus - they pretty much sum-up why TVR is in the shape it's in.
I used to visit the factory in the late 80's and nothing has changed - apart from the ludicrous shape of the cars. The most telling image is the diff housing being held in position on a paint tin. WTF?
There also seems to be a lot of re-painting going on.  I hope that the blue car is an accident repair and is not on the production line, being re-preped and primered after it's original clearcoat - and then sold as a new car.
In a way, the cottage industry-like atmosphere (reminds me of AML prior to Ford's ownership) is quaint - but redundant. Aston would have gone down the toilet too, had they remained blacksmiths. Death, where is thy sting?

It's like something out of the 1930's isn't it? Workers are probably all members of the Amalgamated Union of Hat-wringers and Allied Trades. No wonder they are going bust. I've been in a few nasty grubby factories in my time and this one is right up there. The state of cleanliness is appalling, no wonder the cars are such shoddy products. I bet it's not like that at Noble. In fact, recalling a recent trip to my local car body shop, well you could eat your dinner off their floor. TVR looks like it hasn't heard of the new fangled vacuum cleaner yet. They've had years to improve this situation, but attitudes and practices become entrenched.

That's exactly the reason why they move the production location. The trouble is that this will mean more redundancies if they leave Blackpool.

Not by my reading of the situation. They are shutting down simply because they cannot sell enough cars to continue production. What kind of quality control will they now be able to excert on the manufacturing process?

Well I say its a crying shame - don;t forget they had Le Mans heritage and did far better than I thought they would even tho a tool company sponsorsed them ( De Walt )

A mans car - you never saw girly drivers in them, but for me they lost the plot after the Grantura, Vixen and 3500M and of course Grifith 427  - the Cerebera and after was too esoteric, too expensive and had too many better alternatives.

I wish they had stuck to their roots, the fast back 2 seater was always a successful formula - MGBGT for one, and I'm still looking for a successor for the big trip in June.

Finally a TVR story - a guy showing off his new convertible pulled into teh pub car park, Brmmm, Brmmm ( great engine noise ), heads turned, he switched his ignition key off and promptly pulled out the whole barrel. Mmmm - Cool!

Regards

Bryan C

I'm no great fan of progress so if TVR want to produce cars in a 1930s garage then so be it, I think its called individuality (or something similar), however the price should reflect the quality not just the outrageous styling.
The buyers pay their money and make a choice, but standards and expectations have risen.

Personally I'd go for something from Deutchland but it will be a shame if a distinctive (British) manufacturer goes under.

As to government (or any other tax payers) support, no way - if the company doesn't make a profit then tough it may well have to go under- let the ruskie pay for his toys!

This country has a great motoring heritage but with low cost mass produced manufactured imports perhaps not a great future.

I used to go out with a bloke that had one (a Griffith I think), was a complete bustard to drive.  I only tried it once driving home from Siverstone in heavy stop/start traffic - was knackering.  We went to LM in it one year, it had less boot space than my MR2 and virtually none once you put the roof in there!!
 
Was great for track days at Castle Combe tho (took  a couple of trips through the cornfield) and I did love the noise it made.

I liked some of the lil styling details, like door buttons under the wing mirror n that kinda thing, but really it was a case of the whole being less than the sum of the parts......... or sommat like that!  ???

F

Would worry me to look at the chassis, solid looking spine with little on the outer edge. Bet that twists well under power, and don't slide it into a tree you'd have little protection.
Beside that did like the noise and the look of some. Reliability could be better, remember travelling down a couple of years ago and being passed by one flat chat, commented we would pass him when he broke down. Within 15 mins there he was, bonnet up on the side of the road.

Ignoring Matts petty wind up attempts and some of the other negative points; you’re missing the point of TVR's. No they are not the best built, most refined "Super Cars" on the road and sure you can buy an M beamer for the same money, but what you do get is bucket loads of character and a fabulous noise (yes it does sound like an aeroplane - abit like a vette with an performance exhaust) no it doesn’t handle as well as a multi million developed car, but how often do you get the chance to push any car to its limits on the road? Being close to BMW head office we see lots of new Beamers being driven like complete hooligans just get some character out of them and then coming to grief and sometimes in some innocent car full of kids. Followed a M6 the other day, very noisy V8, maybe they have taken the point.
Just like Morgan and Lotus, TVR are a British institution that like many institutions have their faults but what the F**k their great to drive.

 

It is sad to see the loss of an English car manufacturer, but it's not really a supprise. Build quality?
Overall package! I've only driven one and its the only sports car i've driven where the "limit" can arrive ....err..well before you would hope!
Do like some of the curves though and the sound is good while it lasts!

P.S I was bourne in Blackpool, if there is a good thing to come from this. At least the B.B.C can fit another rollercoaster in!

Having tried, believe me, you wouldn't want to be a breakdown mechanic trying to get under the bonnet of some of those blarry things to fix 'em either...

A factory job just to look for the starter motor on 'em.

Prolly great driving for a geezer, but Fran points out the drawbacks.

Shame, but ta ta Trevor!

 ;)


bill

Friend of my Dads had a Griffith for a while, but it kept breaking down, so he decided to get rid of it.

He rang the local 'performance' car specialist and said

"I've got a TVR Griffith that I'm looking to sell, would you be interested?"

The salesmans reply was

"Huh, I'd  rather have AIDS"

I read in last Saturday's Telegraph Motoring Section that TVR's ex-owner, Peter Wheeler, still owns the factory site.
Also, there appears to be some sort of dispute between Wheeler and current owner, Nikolai Smolensky.

The move to another site looks to be pretty obvious considering this.

This wasn't a petty wind-up attempt. I don't think there is any further need to  perpetuate the "TVR's suck/don't suck" debate (it's pretty subjective anyway).
I think the main issue is that not enough people like them to make them viable. I also feel that what appeal they have seems to attract a certain type of individual.
I have never owned one, but I've driven quite a few. I was very unenthused by any of them - based purely on what they cost versus the alternatives (in the same catagory).
I accept that some people and most owners think they are great - the fact still remains, not enough people buy 'em.
One final point that I have to disagree and call bollix on ya on, is where you state that they are fun to drive. On this point, I will exercise my right to be subjective. They are scarily not fun to drive quickly. They are not competent super-cars (for want of a better word). Most owners drive them slowly, because of this reason, preferring to stare at themselves in the reflection of shop windows, manditorily blipping the throtte in a further "Look how cool I am" gesture.

I think the UK car market is having a very tough time in general, so proportionally TVR will have suffered, but in a more critical way, a down turn in sales will hit them harder, simple business economics - still plenty of people ready to buy, but proportionally not enough to generate the economies of scale.
There is also obviously some background manovering going on for both funding and rent reviews by the new owner.
As for posing in shop window reflections and blipping the throttle, lots of people do that, especially if you've got a largish V8, not reserved for TVR's, you can’t stereotype them, there are always going to be tossers, almost a KKK view.
Just pisses me off that some of the last Uk manufacturing jobs heading into decline (like any Car co they are many, many suppliers that will also be hit), but its Ok The TVR boys can get jobs in Blackpool looking after people on holiday - Oh they are stopping coming, Oh they lost their jobs in the factories that generated GNP, that’s OK though cos they can get jobs in the service industry, like bank call centres, Oh they've gone to India, Oh....... Bollocks, no Jobs for anybody apart from a few offshore service industry brokers.
So sorry, can’t agree with your pleasure at TVR's decline matt, we've not yet bailed out of Blighty or want to.. 

That's a little bit unfair IRW - go back to the beginning of this thread. I'm as saddened as anyone by the thought of job loss - particularly when it's through no fault (on the work-force's part). It's happened to me enough times to appreciate the misery of the situation.
My point is that these are cars that are designed with no realistic thought as to who is going to buy them.
I was a supplier to TVR for a few years and back then they had a lovely 'family' feel to the business. Peter Wheeler used to bring his dog to work with him. But even then it was blindingly obvious that you can't run a modern manufacturing enterprise the way they did - and survive long-term. I don't think TVR have ever really known who their customers are.
I appreciate that things are tough in UK manufacturing - and it is horrible that hard-working people with families and responsibilities get kicked to the kerb - but that is the way of the world - always has been.
The fact that you're not prepared to bail out of Blighty, although commendable is, I suspect, a bit of a dig at me personally, because I've done just that. There are a lot of things I miss about Britain, but the strife-filled economy and TVR's ain't among them. IRW - your patriotism is a credit to you  - but who in their right mind would take a TVR over a new similarly priced Bimmer or Audi? 

A similar parallel can be drawn with Morgan.  They're a small, niche market, UK car manufacturer, using ancient premises and manufacturing processes to build a very select and specialist vehicle.

10 or so years ago, they were the subject of John Harvey-Jones' Troubleshooter TV series where he investigated small companies to see if their business and bottom-line profit could be improved and moderised.  As I recall, he was dumbfounded that a company that built cars the way Morgan did (do) could have a full order book and a 10 year waiting list.

I guess Morgans appeal to the more mature, traditional, flat-capped middle England buyer who wants an old style, hand built car.  As long as there are these types of people, Morgan will have a market place.

TVR, on the other hand, try to do provide what a large chunk of the market also do - in essence, to build a fast, sporty, 'sexily' styled, 2 seater car at a £40K - £50K ish price tag.
They have a lot of mainstream competition, most with the backing of much larger motor vehicle building corporations.  The Honda S2000 is a case in point - a good car backed by the reputation of a huge company.  Also, how could Honda continue to build the NSX for all those years with miniscule sales figures if it wasn't a Honda.

The UK car industry is continually seeing the much heralded re-launch and resurrection of UK car names from the past.  What happened to the 'new' Fraser Nash, the 'new' Jensen, the 'new' Marcos?
I guess the marketplace just doesn't have that much spare room.

Hmmmm...is the topic dead or is TVR dead....any news about it?

Bartus(who still considers buying one when he wins his next million)

Must say I agree with Mr Zarse on this one!

They sound good but are usually driven by people of "that" ilk....

Drove a chimera once years back, fun but got the impression that plastic, uk roads and brute force and ignorance underpinnings would lead to a meeting with Mr hedge backwards very quickly. The owner (not for long), a family friend, advised me not to play with anything apart from gearstick, pedals and steering wheel as if touched it may either come off in hand or not work again!
 Inspired with confidence we had a little blat round the New Forest. It was good but, would rather have my  84' 300c estate (honestly). Equally shiddy handling, better built,all works after 20 years, still sounds good and gives warning of impending doom.

Shame if poor folks lose their jobs after being a part of something special for so long..... but I am sure that there will be some polish/Romanian workers more than happy to pitch in and do it for half the money to keep things moving!! (Sure you get what I mean!!!)

Also had a lift in an early (1976?? ford v6) one once. Horrid bucket of sh1te.

Finally.... one good thing to say!!!!!!!!!!!!! the Metallic Purple Cerebra with N7TRO reg that does rolling burnouts on the M27 eastbound in the mornings traffic is cool!! Bellowing zorst and popping flames on overrun always make the drive to work more bearable. Anyone know him??