Club Arnage

Thanks to the great www.dailysportscar.com site for the photos


Earthworks At Le Mans
These photographs (taken by Claude Foubert today, December 19) indicate that the changes to the approach of the Dunlop Chicane at Le Mans are more significant than the sketches suggested.

The final image shows the view from the main entrance of the circuit (next to the museum) and what has happened to the tunnel leading to the village and the paddock.

 

and

and

I hope they are going to pull their finger out, it's only 6 months to go!!!!!

What the f**k are the ACO up to?  :oI thought Le Mans was a road race for road going based cars, they are turning the place into a sterile F1 type circuit. Personally I think they f**ked it up when they changed the run down to esses, and you can guarentee that the viewing areas will be even further away with this lasest change. :(

The track works should be finished by march next year.

The entrance to the Dunlop chicane should be better as it well have a little straight before it and the chicane is tighter, so it should be easier to overtake.
It also means the pit exit can be up a bit to make it possible to have the extra garages for 07.

Not sure if the 'village' will be complete by then.

I may be a lone voice but I think the village revamp was well over due.

Looks like the worlds largest sandbox to me.  What the f**k is the matter with that bunch?  Do they just like rippping up the tarmac and re-configuring the circut for the hell of it?  I agree with Bob, its looks like just another piece of sh*t new F1 circut now.  Completely devoid of any character.
Fax

looks good to me - the dunlop chincane was put in anyway to slow the bikes down.   that exercise has been repeated twice i think over the last 100 years. 

A revamp yes, but I'm worried it will no longer be the village - just stands for the big outfits, and "corporate hospitality" venues.  As for the track, all we get is more chicanes, and they've ruined the balance of the esses.

So the Dunlop press tower definatley got pulled down then  :'(

That's it then ..... March 2006 - SEBRING 12 HOURS for me.  ;D

Where will the fair go? will it be on the other side of MB like last year? don't know about you lot but one of the enduring images of LM for me was the lights of the fair and the big wheel behind the Dunlop press tower viewed from the tribunes. :'(
Looking at the pics of the revamped village on the ACOs site the area where the tower stood has a couple of what look like enclosed grandstand/seating areas, more ,club privee' maybe?? will there be anywhere for us plebs to watch from by the end of the decade?

If I'm getting this correctly, the Dunlop chicane is going to be tighter?!  Which begs the question WHY?!  What the f**ck!  Do they want to make sure the cars come to complete stop before accelerating away?  Why not put a traffic light there complete with a school crossing guard...
I may be bit old fashioned but I always thought part of the premise of motor racing was cars actually going fast.
Stupid f**ckers is the thought that springs to mind when I think of the ACO.
Fax

It all started when they got rid of the Pontlieuie Hairpin at the back of Carrefour.  There are more injuries in football and in the home.  1955 was 50 years ago, and Jo Gartner's death must be nearly 20.  Are the insurance companies to blame?

I honestly think playing ice hockey is more dangerous than motor racing these days.  The sport has become sanitized to the point of making me want to puke.  The circut at Le Mans is a f**k*ng joke, a drivers biggest concern now is how much gravel he's going to get in his shoes climbing out of the gravel trap.  This is no longer a sport for heroes, not the same walking the tightrope with a big safety net under you.
Fax

Now there's not a lot of Ice Hockey in the UK, but an old friend used to play, and a puck came through the glass screen and took out his wife's top lip and most of her teeth. 

None of my friends have been injured in motorsport, either spectating, marshalling or competing, although there have been a few misses, and I have seen the ambulance out a few times.  (My nephew did crash a kart at a social event, and it was the damn helmet that cut his chin.)

I'd like to keep it this way but not at any cost.  Flying can be dangerous, but we still do it.

Oh God I am going to miss that Dunlop press club building, fantastic place for night photos.
I bet they make it more difficult for cripples like me to get down onto the track at 1600 hrs on Sunday too.

 :(

Change can always be good and bad, although, does the circuit need more places for overtaking ?

They've turned the circut into giant point & squirt karting track.  Its all about short straights and chicanes.  You scrabble through a chicane then mash down on the throttle, throw on the anchors and pop & fart through another chicane.  There's no flow to the circut anymore, and bashing through chicanes is hardly a test of a drivers ability.  Why in the f**ck are they so afraid of medium and high speed corners?  Thats where you really separate the men from the boys.  Its laughable to watch on TV too.  They're destroying all of the hallmarks and heritage of the place.  When I became a racing fan and I thought of Le Mans, things like the Mulsanne Straight, the fairground next to the esses, the Dunlop curve, the old pits, were all what came to mind.  They're all gone now, it might as well be Jerez or Valencia.  The place bares no resemblence at all to the circut that existed for decades.  If I go back this year, it'll be to see friends and have a good party, to be honest the race itself has become a piss-poor shadow of what it once was and holds little interest for me.  If I want to watch a race I'll go to Sebring or Road Atlanta.
Fax

Hi BobU I agree completely would just add: FENCES  :'( :'( for those who ahave not yet made the trek to Le Mans get there soon before it is all gone.
Canada Phil

The chicane is getting tighter, but there this is because there is a staight section just before it. This is required because the pit lane exit has been moved so that the extra garages can be built.

To be honest a chicane is a chicane no matter how tight or open it is. That section was f**ked anyway since it was put in.

Most of the current mods have been forced onto the track by either the FIM or the local gov for there tramway.

Just out of interest, since the chicanes have been put onto the Mulsanne, has there been a serious crash there that resulted in injury apart from the flying merc?

A Jaguar E type had a nasty off down the far end at last years Classic.

but do remember, the 24hr Car race is only one of many races held there each year for many different forumula and Vehicles - and chicanes are needed to slow some of these down. 

Silverstone did similar about 10years ago with their revisions  - taking it from being one of the fastest circuits of its day, to one where spectator viewing was more readily available - virtually all the corners were revised/removed.   

You say they need the chicanes to slow vehicles down, just out of curiosity, why do they need to be slowed down?  At US speedways the specatators are very close to sustained high speed action (far higher than at any Euro venue) and accidents invloving spectators are very rare.   Everyone I know who's been to Silverstone since the changes tell me its crap now!
Fax

Thats a very good question that I ask myself since the Woodcote chicane was inserted at silverstone, the first one that I really came across.

I don't think the Dunlop corner or the run into the Esses needed slowing, there is after all a pedal the drivers can use if the car is getting a bit out of hand. That whole section of track has now changed since I first went and its not a patch on what was there before.

Having said that the new esses section is not in itself a bad set of bends IMHO, and on any other track would be good, but they are just not as good as the original.

Nordic, you hit on the screws.  Its up to the driver and his right foot to control the situation.  At the Ring and the Montjuich Park circut in Barcelona there were several places where cars became airborne, it was up to the driver to control how airborne he got.  Agreed about the old Woodcote corner, that was one of the most majestic corners in all of racing, they've butchered that circut all to hell & back.  Corners like Stowe, Club and Abbey used to be mind melters.
Fax

ACO has posted loads of pics here. http://www.lemans.org/sport/sport/dossiers/travaux/index.html

Martini...

The current webcam is rather depressing

http://www.lemans.org/sport/sport/dossiers/travaux/i_travaux_village_webcam.html

(http://www.lemans.org/webcam/image.jpg)

At least the sun is out! It looks bl****dy awful. Yuk! ::)

I think the ACO are being totally irresponsible!  Someone could have a very bad accident when they drive over the top of that big mound!

Hi Dave,
              First time out of the pits will be exciting too. May need more than diesel to get through that terrain ::) 4 wheel drive atleast ;D Canada Phil

Looks like they're building the latest version of the Maginot Line, "Huh huh...Zee Germans will never be able to go over zees"......DOHHH! (Where's the Homer Simpson icon?)
Fax

Does this new diesel Audi have caterpillar tracks and a 'dozer blade?

I remember the rumours when Porsche entered the 4wd 961 - it was to make sure they won if it snowed.  It ran well, but caught fire, with the in car video running.  This revealed a new marshal's flag signal.  Waving a red fire extinguisher in the air means your car is on fire.

 :( ??? Yep I have been watching that for the last 3 days, and it does not appear to have changed  ::) ;)

At least there is no snow on it................................... yet!  ;D

I had a new experience the other day chaps, I sh*t myself as I pulled my hat on.
Now, incontinence isn't exactly a stranger round these parts, I once cr*pped myself in Cameroon while stooping to brush my teeth, and that was no picnic, but I must admit that the hat incident caught me completely by surprise, and for the last few days, and probably for the forseeable future, I'm steering clear of any headgear, just in case.
Anyway, the general discomfort, not to mention the pong, got me thinking of Maison Blanche, transparent sewer pipes, wild bets and toilet facilities as a hole.
The ACO seem to be digging some very big ones, and in all the wrong places! Do you think it's a new toilet system? How is it that to me and others it's got 'DISASTER FOR THE RACING SPECTATOR' written all over it, maybe it's the ACO's past record on these things, but I fear that this could be the final nail in the coffin for the event. Is there going to be a reason for leaving the campsite I wonder, you can't really see the cars anymore and the fair and all it's wonders has all but disappeared, now it looks like the bars will have gone, or at least replaced with glossy corporate cr*p, - temples to Audi and the ACO rather than E-Coli and Our Bottoms.
H

H - was this a Bowler blow-out, a Homburg heave or a Derby dump?

I find it reassuring that others have lower intestinal distress related to their activities of daily living.  For some strange reason, I always start to pucker when I go into Staples office equipment store or Home Depot.  Strangely, Lowes doesn't have the same effect.

I think we all know the ACO have not been making modifications to this track over the last 16 years with spectators in mind, so I would hope no one on this site is remotely surprised by what is currently unfolding.  Just yet ANOTHER reason to have the right set-up camping-wise and not rely on what's available at the track.  You'd think all the vendors would be wondering WTF wouldn't you?

Personally, they could make this a frickin oval at this point in time and I don't think it would impact my overall experience at all.  As long as the Nigerian's cold.

It looks to me like they're preparing the Bugatti circut to make a run at the French GP.  I don't know what the status is of the contract with Magny Cours, I don't follow F1 anymore so I really don't give a f**ck but thats seems to me to be the only reason why they would butcher the place the way they have.  After all it'll need to be nice and sterile for all the F1 posers, god forbid they get some soil on the soles of their shoes, the FIA would strip them of their status and give the race to Nepal.
Fax

You could be right Fax, the track already has the Moto GP so the French GP would be attractive to them.

Both Brands & LM where changed to meet the needs for the Moto GP or SBk's rather than the cars. There's more money in bikes than cars right now outside the gp's. Even these are not the cash cows of the recent past as the current troubles in Germany show.

These guys need to be stopped before every last track is a drone and the drivers and riders need to be reminded that its up to them how fast to go round a bend.

Interesting that you mention the bike money vs car cash Nordic, somewhat similar over here.  In a recent study of where the motorsports fan is spending his dollar in the US, NASCAR was on top followed by the NHRA but after that the next two most popular are AMA Supercross & Superbike.
Fax

Just looking at the webcam, perhaps the French are going to use the slope for the thier ski jump team to practise in advance of the olympics.

The village, now heres a thought...............................some may say is quaint and one of the last surviving relics of the good old days (l agree), however inline with modernisation dont be suprised if the newe and "better" village has: Macdonalds, Starbucks, Phones4u and of course a Weatherspoons amongst its retailers :o ::)

Wotcher Dave,
To be honest, I'd have welcomed a fart in a fedora like an old friend, still, at least I can put all those christmas pressie boxer shorts to good use now. Mind you, I always find the white ones a little, how shall I say, difficult. Especially feigning gratitude for them...
How's Fatherhood coming along, damn fine I hope? By my reckoning you should have yet another on the way by now, but that's just statistics for you. Hang on in there dude!
I think fax has echoed pretty well most of my sentiments re the track and all who sail in her, and once again I'll be looking forward to June more as a re-union/party/piss up/near death experience, rather than a race event. What's a little hard though (steady, steadddy...) is each year we invariably have a 'virgin' or two with us, and of course we do our best to show them the circuit and all it's attractions, but it's just so difficult to stop yourself saying 'it used to be so much better than this' wherever we go. Apart from maybe the cr*ppers next to Smokies Castle.
H

Don't forget, H, that the castle is no more.  At best, it will be reincarnated as a canvas replica.

Del

Sitting in an ice cold ski-gondola going up the mountain, I managed to put my finger in a frozen docker's omlette that a previous occupant had most thoughtfully spat on the seat. Bright yellow it was, with all flecks of blood in. It was certainly a new one on me, and needless to say, it soon had me wretching and heaving to the great delight of the Gimp.

Regrettably I can see no relavance to earth works at LM, it's just that foul tales have been a bit thin on the ground round these parts lately and I thought you'd all like to know.

LOL ;D

Smokies castle gone Del!!! Have the relevant heritage and waste water management authorities been informed?
Rumours are rife, so are my pants for that matter, but this time I refer to the size of pitches on MB. It seems there is a European Standard, decided upon in Brussels, and set to sprout at Le Mans this year, apparently it's all to do with health and safety and fire regulations. 3mX4m I hear, for vehicle and tent.
It mentions nothing about personal pissoirs or dodgy Volvos, so I'm expecting terrrouble...
How's the TB innoculation going Andy?
H

I thought there was something about being 5 metres apart for fire reasons.  What do you do with a caravan that is 5 metres long, 4 and a half wide with awning, add the car and thats 6 x 5 metres, or two and a half standard pitches.

3x4 is a car parking space

Fear not Lorry.  I have a chain saw.

My last caravan's just gone up in so much smoke that the neighbours have complained.  Anyone going near the new one is in serious trouble. See http://www.electricfence-online.co.uk/

http://www.lemans.org/sport/sport/actu/2006_01_10_bombe_gb.html

oh dear, they found a bomb!!!

Holy sh*t! :o
Looks like an American five hundred pounder, minus its tail fins (standard high explosive ordinance of a B-17 or B-24)
How'd you like to be the bulldozer driver who stumbled on that?  I'd sh*t myself.
Fax

That's not a bomb, that was left over from our firework display last year :o

Concur with Fax that it is a US one - the Germans didn't bomb France much and it certainly isn't big enough for the standard RAF fare of 1,000 pounders.   It's where it is that makes one wonder how many of us have walked around there.....and how many others may still be buried.... 

MG Mark

I'm betting during the build-up to D-Day the rail yards were pasted pretty good, either that or from a Mustang run at the airfield.
Fax

And who was it on here that recommended digging a hole to stash your BBQ and camping kit? Imagine digging one of those babies up :o

From the photos posted, that bomb site is just by the slope of the old tunnel from the main entrance to the Poo Bar !!!

(the old double tunnel has been completely dug out as shown in the first photo)

Apologies if this has been posted already  can't be arsed to read the thread in full!!!

The new paddock layout etc. can be seen here:

http://www.lemans.org/sport/sport/dossiers/travaux/ressources/plans/slides/plan_masse_1024.jpg

So the new welcome centre isn't planned unit 2007 ! - but they've knocked the old one down.

Or blown up ;D  Think I'd be treading lightly or....KA BOOM!
Fax

 ;D...and that surprises you how?? ;D  this is the ACO we're talking about!!  (perhaps it's comments like that that explain why I never get my ticket allocation!)

.... and I DO  ;D ;D ;D 

 ;)

Hi Fax, or maybe these guys from 6 Group RAF Bomber Command on the 23rd May 1944.

112 Halifaxes from 420, 424, 425, 426, 427, 429, 432, and 433 Squadrons were ordered on an attack of the rail yards at Le Mans. The crews were over the target at between 7,000 and 9,000 feet, releasing 826,000 lbs of high explosives. According to reports, bombing was accurate and severe damage was caused.

P/O W. Fernyhough from 432 Squadron returned without bombing as there were no T.I’s.
F/Sgt S. Kuleski RCAF and crew, flying Halifax III MZ-506 coded QO-X, failed to return from this operation.

Sgt E. Horton RAF
F/O W. Matthews RCAF
F/Sgt B. Richmond RCAF
W/O2 J. Desmarais RCAF
Sgt E. Boutilier RCAF
Sgt M. Wiwsianski RCAF
Sgt W. Crum RCAF
All were killed.

You're right... a lot of them are still buried.

This part of the city is where most of bombings were made. If you can rmember the military camp just face to the aerodrome, this is where stood the Jeumont Schneider factory. This factory was used during the WW2 as a test and production facility for Junkers engines !!! SO it was a strategic place to bomb, a massive destruction weapon facility.

Hi Fax, or maybe these guys from 6 Group RAF Bomber Command on the 23rd May 1944.

112 Halifaxes from 420, 424, 425, 426, 427, 429, 432, and 433 Squadrons were ordered on an attack of the rail yards at Le Mans. The crews were over the target at between 7,000 and 9,000 feet, releasing 826,000 lbs of high explosives. According to reports, bombing was accurate and severe damage was caused.

P/O W. Fernyhough from 432 Squadron returned without bombing as there were no T.I’s.
F/Sgt S. Kuleski RCAF and crew, flying Halifax III MZ-506 coded QO-X, failed to return from this operation.

Sgt E. Horton RAF
F/O W. Matthews RCAF
F/Sgt B. Richmond RCAF
W/O2 J. Desmarais RCAF
Sgt E. Boutilier RCAF
Sgt M. Wiwsianski RCAF
Sgt W. Crum RCAF
All were killed.

Phil are these the guy that the memorial is to or is it a generic Canadian memorial - we visited it last year - have pics somewhere but I can't remember the content of it?

I found this, the US Eighth Air Force hit the airfield with heavy bombers in conjuction with the Normandy landings.  I'm betting thats where our little buried buddy came from.
Fax
http://www.usaaf.net/ww/vol2/vol2pg18.htm

Very interesting picture. 

I think the pit straight is the road cutting the top left hand corner.  You can't identify any pits or stands amongst the mirk, except for a large building near what is now the Ford chicane, which I think is a appears in the old films.

Yes there are hits around the tunnel, and for such a large target there appear to be a number of misses, although from the amount of smoke and dust over the runway the mission must have been accomplished.

It would be interesting to know what the actual objective was for the bombing?  What types of aircraft were based at Le Mans during June '44 and also the railway is nearby, so what reserve forces were located here?  I do know that the French resistance were sabotaging railway wagons to prevent the armoured reserves reaching the landing area.

Certainly a top priority was keeping the Luftwaffe off the beaches so I suspect if it had so much as a WWI Fokker biplane located there, they were going to hammer it.  Unusual though to send heavy bombers at a airfield, usually more of a target for medium-light bombers and fighters on more hit & run type raids.  Must have been something there they REALLY wanted to get rid of.
Fax

For a few months before D Day, about half the heavy bomber raids were to soften up the Normandy area, so all military targets, plus the usual railway yards, bridges etc would have got their share.

Hmmh, I thought the main bomber effort was away from the Normandy area, thus ensuring the Germans believed the assault would be in the Par d Calais?

Might be worth a beer and a chat during a meetup somewhere?

came across this about Le Mans airfield.  It seems the Germans had a large bomb dump there and us Brits gave it a pasting during the assault over the night of 9/10 June '44, so the bomb may be one of our's?

Le Mans airfield was an important Luftwaffe bomb dump stocked with quantities of 250 kg. bombs. Although neither I. nor II./JG 1 had received any training as fighter-bombers, both Gruppen were assigned the Jabo (Jagd-Bomber) role on June 8th. The pilots of the two air defense units were to read a text on Jabo tactics and were sent off on missions that same day. II. Gruppe started off on its first fighter-bomber mission at 1100 hours with twenty-five Focke-Wulfs against the Allied armada off the Normandy coast. They were not intercepted, and other than the many flak hits received from the defending ships, all aircraft returned safely. No hits were claimed. Bad weather on 9 June kept most German and Allied air units grounded, but II. Gruppe did manage one Jabo mission with twenty aircraft off the coast. Again, they weren't intercepted and suffered no losses. That night, at approximately 0100 hours, Le Mans airfield was attacked by RAF four-engined bombers. II. Gruppe lost seven aircraft and five more damaged, even though they were dispersed 500 meters east of the airfield. These losses plus numerous bomb craters kept it grounded for the next six days. On 12 June, Oblt. von Kirchmayr was released from the hospital in Störmede after a bout of infectious yellow jaundice and allowed to fly back to his unit, but was attacked by Spitfires over Flers. He shot down one of the Spitfires, but the victory was never confirmed due to the lack of a witness. On the 15th, the Gruppe lost two more Focke-Wulfs during a bombing attack on Le Mans.

http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/2072/FGnorm.html

Interesting reading there Spider, looks like they were hitting it day & night.  Between the airfield, the Junkers facility Gilles mentioned and the rail yards the city of Le Mans was getting alot of attention from RAF Bomber Command and the USAF Eighth Air Force.  Be carefull driving those tent stakes into the ground guys. ;D
Fax

On the overflow field in between Blue Sud and the southern end of the airfield there is a big stagnant water filled hole up in the top corner, it has no water leading into it (360 days of the year anyway, it smells very nasty by Sunday night), it's about the same size and shape as the bomb craters that litter the moors above my native Sheffield. Could it be a remnant that wasn't filled in? its only about half a Km from the runway.

Good god - this means they were camping in the Houx, if my geography's correct.

One of our team used to think that there was a submarine buried in MB, about where Team JPC were this year.  You'd knock a tent peg in for a couple of inches, and then it would just stop dead.  Now we know what it was.

Phil are these the guy that the memorial is to or is it a generic Canadian memorial - we visited it last year - have pics somewhere but I can't remember the content of it?
Hi Piglet,
              The memorial near Arnage corner is indeed to this flight crew. It marks the crash site. Shot down by the Anti Aircraft battery located at Tetre Rouge. All the airmen are buried at the Le Mans west Cemetery.
All squadrons mentioned in the report are RCAF
Canada Phil

Not forgetting the pit lane was destroyed to not be used as a provisory airfield...

Found this posted on another fourm, makes for sober reading.

just did some googling in french to have some numbers about those bombs, the french mine clearing department have found in the last 60 years some 660000 bombs ,13.5 million mines, 24 million shells. 617 persons died in those clearing operation . more then 50% of those bomb are from WW1(la grande guerre) , the estimation is that 1 billion shell /"obus" were shot during the ww1 . 200 million during WW2 ,15 to 25 % didnt explode. the french government have to destroy 300 tons of those bombs every year . and now they have the ecologist on there back

Wow :o that is a hell of a lot of explosive. Do these things deteriorate over the years and become safer due to the detonaters etc rusting away or do they become more unstable and become even more dangerous?

BOB ITS THE LATER.  THAT GOES FOR ALL THINGS THAT GO BANG, FROM BULLETS TO HIGH EXPLOSIVE, MOST OF IT IS DISPOSED OF IN SITU IF POSSIBLE.  GAS ORDANACE WHICH STILL TURNS UP IN THE WW 1 BATTLEFIELDS HAS TO BE TAKEN AWAY.

So now it can be told!

The ACO is pressing car makers to produce quieter race cars, simply because the old bombs are getting more unstable every day.

And the reason they keep effin around with the circuit is...

Ditto.

The more they find the less we do

 ;)


roll on June and I can get over there and do my patriotic duty...

Carrefour will provide, - mine detectors no doubt.

now I am even more excited.

 ;D

Its top of the shopping list.  I'm not going to knock in another tent peg without one.

This could explain why some of the firework displays are so good.  One dropped fag end and WHOOSH.

Tap, tap,tap....ka,boom!
All joking aside, its unfortunate that we have to discuss things like unexploded bombs burried in the sod we hold so near and dear.  There were a lot of damn good young men who gave their lives so that we can camp & drink our faces off on this bit of French turf.
They probably would've enjoyed the race too...
Fax

I can't begin to imagine what it must have been like to be living somewhere that was being bombed, be it london, Le Mans or Berlin.

The freedoms we take for granted came at a very high price and should be treasured not abused.

All of this had me thinking of a encounter I had back in summer.  One Saturday afternoon a couple of buddies and I were out for a long ride on the motorbikes and decided to stop in a little typical road side Pub.  Sitting alone was a small, elderly man wearing a cap with the insignia of a Eighth Air Force bomber group and a small pin of a B-17.  I politely asked him if he served with that group and he replied that he was a tail gunner on a B-17 between July of 1944 through Feb 1945.  I told him how heroic I thought he was and he replied very modestly that there was nothing heroic about it, just doing his bit.
I asked if he had any kills and he told me that he shares a ME-109 kill, he said he and about five other gunners put fire on it and brought it down, but he said one of their waist gunners had a confirmed ME-109. When he talked about looking out his position and seeing another Fortress hit and in trouble he became very emotional.
As you said, it came at a very high price.
Fax

The tail gunners position on most large Allied bombers was a cold, remote and lonely place.
You were also vunerable to attack from behind.
I don't envy him one bit but take my hat off to his bravery and determination.

And of courrse a rear gunner couldn't wear his parachute in the turret, having to hope the hydraulics still work, straighten the turret, climb out put on parachute and then jump!

In a similar vein, I never fail to be moved by the area around Spa, so many lives lost in both first and second world wars - civilian, Allied forces and German forces.    It's one of my favourite places and the whole area is now so peaceful it seems hard to imagine the carnage and loss of life that occured there.   We try to go and visit at least one monument or war cemetary when we are there. 

The war cemetarys up on the Normandy Coast are moving places to visit also.  Stopped off at one on the way home fom LM one year and was stopped dead in my tracks by the sight of the rows of white crosses.  Going to Pegasus Bridge just two weeks after the 60th Anniversary of D Day had a similar effect.  It is truly humbling to think of what people did back then so we can enjoy the lives and freedom we have today.

Ferrari Spider and I stopped off at Pegasus Bridge on the way back from The Classic in 2004 and is well worth a visit! If you do go, try to make sure you get to listen to the British chaps doing the commentary on what happened. He's one of those people who brings the whole thing to life and you could sit and listen to for hours!

Pegasus Bridge not only a very interesting place to visit but also absolutely key for the British part of the assault.  Unfortunately, Mr Worthington, who gave the talk, is now at Arromanches, so you can catch him there.

Very popular place to stop, plenty of other worthwhile D-Day sites to visit.

The 360 degree cinema at Amoranches is well worth a visit. If the film doesn't make you come out in goose bumps then nothing will.

I did ask this gentleman what their instructions were for bailing out from his position and they told him simply...Any way you can!
I asked him if he'd flown in a B-17 since the war (B-17's fly into Cincinnati a couple of times a year for airshows at a local municipal airfield, they offer 45 minute rides to the public in a Flying Fortress for about three hundred dollars, which is tax deductable, but the flights are free to veterans.)  He replied "Nah, spent enough time in one of those things.  Said they're cold, noisy, and uncomfortable.
Fax

Hi Fax,
          My buddy Jim refers to himself as a miracle baby. when some one rises to the bait he explains his Dad was a Rear Gunner in RCAF.
He and I are planning a Motorcycle Rally to West Virginia for Memorial Day week end if you would like to join in.
Canada Phil

Hey Phil,
Sounds like fun, West VA's just a stones throw for us, e-mail me the details and, maybe we can talk Harper into shooting over on the Triumph as well. Some great roads to ride on over there, done alot of white water rafting on the New and Gauley rivers over the years.
Fax

I've had a similarly perturbing experience yesterday, and whilst it wasn't a total shock, it did catch me off guard. I crapped myself whilst boarding the 05.13 train from Belgrade to Zurich. You should have seen the state of the Serbian lavs on the train and that was before I cleaned myself up. I certainly can't recommend their toilet paper but fortunately I had a copy of the Daily Mirror to hand. My perrineum has yet to recover.

According to the ACO website, reprofiling of Tetre Rouge has been delayed untill after this years race, due to budget constraints. Work will begin after the Classic.
For 2007 they will build a 'Welcome area' on the inside of Tetre Rouge.
No plebs then ;)

Looking at the webcam. it looks like where the poo bar was is a giant hole in the ground. :(

Re-reading the report, there is a indication that there will be a spectator area between the bend and the Welcome area, we live in hope that it's part of the GA ticket.

Lots of interesting photos in the 'progress' section here http://www.lemans.org/sport/sport/dossiers/travaux/index_gb.html

This one shows the new tunnel with the old Poo Bar site on the other side.
(sorry - big photo)

(http://aco.zones-medias.com/sport/travaux/photos/324_nc_TRV_TRV_DSC_0290.jpg)

Here's a good aerial view (big photo again)

The new Dunlop chicane is 2 90 degree bends now  :'(

(http://aco.zones-medias.com/sport/travaux/photos/253_IF7T3158.jpg)

Whilst I'm sure the new village will be lovely and shimey, quite frankly it will need to be. I mean, there's not going to be a lot of opportunities left for seeing the cars is there? Why on earth should you have to stand about 100 yards away from a forty mph chicane? This change is disasterous from the specatators point of view.

As the ACO says - "The legend is written in your eyes". They should add - "but only with the help of a good pair of binoculars". Hurrumphh!

According to one of my mates working as "geometre" on this earthwork they discover least week an another WWII bomb at Tertre Rouge this time.

It won't be the last and each time it delays end of works.

Opening Race is planned on the Bugatti 18 and 19.March !!!

They have got 108 days til the race, less than 100 til test day. Will the track be ready, let alone the Village? This makes the problems of Wembley Stadium look like a small oversight. Maybe they could hold this years race at the Millenium stadium in Cardiff?

To be honest whatever they do to the Dunlop area of track is meaningless.

It was ruined when the chicane first went in, and it's neither better or worse now. I don't ever stop to watch the cars from there any more.

http://rupert8766.fotopic.net/p7266191.html
http://rupert8766.fotopic.net/p2780294.html

Photos from happier times.

Quite why the cars need to be slowed to walking pace is beyond me, it will cause a bottle neck and lead to more crashes than before.

Slightly before my time Nordic but I take the sentiment. Having said that, standing at the end of the pit straigh looking up the hill, you did sometimes see some good late braking going into what was once a fairly mild first corner. Won't be seeing that again, it'll now be too easy to guard the inside line.

Great pictures Nordic,but a bit before my time too, I do remember those wonderful wooden tribunes. I am sure the accoustics of them contributed to the engine sounds of the cars, unlike the soulless scaffold and canvas monstrosaties they bung up every year now.

I'm affaid that with the remodeling of the Dunlop Chicane, the bloody awful run down to The Esses and the imminant desicration of Tetre Rouge, it seems that the ACO are hell bent on f**cking up all the spectator areas for the genuine Le Mans fan.

Curse the ACO, a pox on them

One would hardly recognise the circuit from when I first started to go.  The old Pits had real character.   They used to be crammed with people from early on the Sat moring till right up to the end of the Race.   The wonderfull new stands are mostly empty.    Though I guess things are better for the Teams these days.

Yes they have to make safety changes from time to time.  But some of the changes look to me to change for changes sake.

t.

Just took a look at the latest aerial photos.
I don't think there's anything left to said...
R.I.P Circuit de la Sarthe
Fax

Looking at that arial pic it makes me wonder if there will be a village at all this year.

Changes to the track are as expected, I'll make sure I'll bring my wire cutter to cut down the fencing for some decent pics. Note to self, buy bigger telelens!!!

Le Mans is only ever as good as your first visit and surely we all look back on that as the best ever. My first time was in 1991 and I have been back every year except one. There are those that use this forum who go back way before me, (Delboy and Big H , to name a couple), who will proberbly say that by 1991 the circuit was already ruined. Restricted access to the pits, chicanes on the Mulsanne, debris fencing and viewing areas further from the action etc. I could never imagine that it could have been any better cos I had never seen it any better.

My point is, when I first went I thought Le Mans was the pinnacle of motor racing experiences and couldn't be any better. Anyone going for the first time this year and has obviesly never seen the circuit, pits and village as were, will think as I did and love it. They will most probebly go back every year and think back on the 2000s as the halcyon days.

By the look of the photos the changes are for the worst, but there is precious little that we or any other paying punter can do to to influence to relentless changes. Sure, a lot of them are safety related but the modern construction of the cars makes them tougher and therefor safer for the drivers and as far as spectator areas being moved back, if the debris fencing is as tough as they make out then I see no reason why the spectators can't be closer.

But lets face it, no matter what the ACO do to wreck the experience it will not stop us from going back every year and enjoying every minute.

All of this construction at the Dunlop Chicane begs the question...WHY! Did they feel the cars weren't going slow enough?
Everytime I've been there and watched (from what seems like 500 yards away) the start from the Dunlop Curve I've wanted to burst out laughing at the sight of the entire field crawling virtually to a stop, its fricking embarrassing.  This is the opening lap of the greatest motor race in the world and it starts with a traffic gridlock?...Thrill a minute stuff there ::)
I just don't get it!  Somebody please enlighten me because I'm clearly missing something about this.  I really feel sorry for the poor bastard who goes for the first time and actually thinks that this is the coolest thing they've ever seen, because they've been completely screwed.
Fax

According to their website, the reconfiguration is because the MotoGP bikes are too fast at that point on the track.  Heaven forbid a temporary chicane be constructed for that weekend, I guess.

We've brought this up before, if they feel the bikes are travelling too quickly through there (last time I checked, my Kawasaki had a throttle & brakes to control that sort of thing) they could build a bypass chicane, like they did at Road Atlanta.  Why f**k things up for the cars as well?
Fax

They did the same thing for the bikes at Road America, putting "the bend" in just before the kink.

Ah, what do we know, anyway?  ::)

At Mid-Ohio the bikes, karts and club cars use the inner loop chicane on the run up to the Keyhole. The pro cars pass it.  This isn't rocket science folks.
Fax

I wonder if the motive is guilt.  They've destroyed the esses as the entry is now at an angle, so they've decided to replace them at Dunlop.  Why dp they keep doing this -look at SIlverstone.  Its like the boy who gets more track for his scalextrix every birthday/xmas so adds a bit on.  Its not an improvement. 

Are Audi paying for it, this is the usual trick to try and keep the lap record; hence Ford Chichane/ Porsche Curves

Holy Mackerel!!
RIP indeed. It looks to me like it's probably a good time to be a gravel salesman in Le Mans. How much of the stuff will they be putting down between the fence and the track? Are they expecting Thrust 2 up the pits straight?
Maybe it's another campsite.
H

It appears something similar to what I've seen at a local level.  Somebody has to run motorsport.  The drivers/teams are too busy so the local meglomaniac appears, takes control and ruins it.  Guess who I'm talking about.