Club Arnage

First one I have seen confirmed.

Nico Rosberg - jumps ship  :)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2009/oct/29/nico-rosberg-williams-formula-one-f1

mmmmmmmmmm Nico Rosberg, he's gawwwwgeous!!  ;D

And it seems bernie has finally shut the door on Donninigton today.

I'm sure the PD will find some reason not to.

Yawn!  Does anyone really care who's driving in F1 now.  F1's really become a laughing joke at this point.  This season will probably go down as one of the most forgettable in history.

Hi Peter,
Life's good thanks, hope all's well with you and that your feeling better.  As far as the USF1 project?  I personally hope the wretched thing never turns a wheel.  I have nothing but comtempt for Peter Windsor, and think him one of the biggest dirt-bags to ever show up in the paddock of a racing circuit.
Fax

Tell me what you think about the USF! project, all this beating about the bush -  ;D

Grape vine is saying that Peter Windsor has been removed from USF1 - How do you feel about having F1 racing in the USA?

There has been some interesting interviews with amongst others, Derek Daly and his views on his son racing single seaters in the USA. Basically, the career ladder goes so far, then the money from stockcars is too good to resist - Hence the lack of decent American single seat drivers.

Jeremy Shaw's program of Team USA is an interesting one, bringing good American single seater drivers over to Europe, indeed Connor di Phillippi won The Walter Hayes Trophey at Silverstone yesterday and Honda Performance Development has a program of fitting a 1.5l Honda Jazz engine to a formula ford to help grass roots racing.

I wonder if America would be more intersted if they had a front running driver??

The USF1 project will have alot more credibility if Windsor's out of the picture.
Kind of hit it on the screws, the temptation to go stock car racing is too great to pass up, given that its much easier to land a competitive ride rather than plodding around in a mid-field car in the single seater ranks.
Fax

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/80002

Toyota are following Honda and Bridgestone out the door??

The Jap's really have fallen out of love with F1, shame as it looks like they may have finally found a driver who can put up a decent show.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/8341602.stm

its now confirmed. Toyota are gone

Could see this coming a mile away, I stand by what I've said before, what the hell do the big manufacturers have to gain by being in F1 now, if you look at the costs involved, and the venues for the race meetings, what's the point?  How many cars are Honda and Toyota selling in Bahrain or Abu Dhabi?  Seriously WTF!
Toyota's NASCAR program costs a fraction of the F1 program, and they race in a country where they actually sell a few cars.
It's all about bang for the buck...
Fax

 ;D

So will Toyota do Le Mans - now or in the future?

Hope they do!

Well maybe the works teams, with the exception of Ferrari will be gone, replaced with a new breed of garagistes.

Renault works team may go, or at least be sold, but i suspect there motor will remain in the sport at least for a while.

I agree with Fax, the major car makers have little to gain in F1 and should stick to suppling engines.

As for Toyota at LM, I doubt it will happen next year as a works team, but there reletionship with Dome is well know. Maybe a bit of works support next year.

TTe I expect to have an R & D role for hybrids in motorsport, maybe WTC and a future GT or rally program.

Agreed, I could never understand why Renault, Honda and Toyota invested this amount of money in F1 when they don't have a single sporty car in their range other than a couple of lairy front drive wheel-spinning hot hatches. They should be like Vauxhall/Opel and not even bother with motorsport as it's pointless to their dull products and image.

At least BMW and Mercedes - though I personally don't really like them - makes some proper rear wheel drive cars with a sporting edge.

Oh and do Peugeot make a single car a keen driver would actually want to drive?

(http://www.dancewithshadows.com/auto/images/peugeot-20cup-concept-1.jpg)

Well I wouldn't mind a bash in one of these.....

Correct, but there could be a market there for Rolls Royce, Bentley and Maybach ;D

Hate to burst your bubble Brad, it has nothing to do with expanding brand awarness, its everything to do with going to countries that are willing to pay Bernie's ridiculous fee for hosting a race.
You should take in a race at Daytona or Talladega before forming opinions.  I'm not a NASCAR fan, but will be the first to admit that a race at one of those venues can be pretty mind-blowing, I've been to both.  Have you?
This year Toyota's will race in 36 NASCAR Sprint Cup races (not to mention all the Nationwide Series events) in front of their largest market, for a fraction of what it cost them to do F1.  Seems to make simple economic sense.
Fax

Brad - with but a few exceptions (rallying and hill climbing are the two that spring to my mind without much thought involved) isn't the majority of motor racing just cars going round and round and round?  The tracks may not be oval, or even anything that could pass as remotely circular, but if you stay in one place the cars will eventually come past again...

Dx

Doris, that's probably why I like drag racing.

dont be daft Steve

you just lurve the NOISE

and the smoke

one day I might come along to try it

bill

hang on - you're either talking about the attraction to manufacturers, or the wider political F1 debate - you can't pick and choose to suit your argument.

F1 has the appeal that it goes to many far flung countries - some of which the manufacturers don't do business with.  It's also shown to billions around the world.  It's ALL about brand awareness - otherwise, there would never have been factory teams - £300 million to be seen by billions every couple of weeks, is actually a good return on investment in normal economic circumstances.


Yes - I've been to Daytona, and very impressive it was too - especially for a football fan (thats soccer for those of you that think FOOTball is played with the hands) it's a brilliant venue, and compares to places like the Noucamp, Old Trafford, and other big places I have been very favourably - , but ultimately, going round and round in simple circles hardly demands the highest level of skill now does it ? even Juan Pablo Montoya  and Michael Andretti could do it....

Toyota have already achieved market penetration in the US.

In other news though, Toyota have realised that the world is bigger than America, and actually, whilst the yanks have a very healthy pond to fish from, the skill, and future of the business comes from being able to attract fish in a puddle - hence the reason for going through the F1 route ..........

as much as Americans believe that their "world series" of anything is being watched around the world - actually, most countries outside of the US have proper sport to watch - so the market penetration in these areas is negligable.

Nice Brad,
Plenty of words but little said.  So why have Toyota, BMW, Honda, and possibly Renault pulled out then?  From where I stand, its poor return on investment, especially given the current economic climate.  After all, the above named manufacturers still compete in a wide variety of other motorsport activities worldwide.
And no, I'm not going to get dragged into another one of your xenophobic arguments regarding the stick& ball stuff, really can't be bothered
Fax

I think it all depends on if your winning.

Honda, Toyota and BMW where not up to the game and rarely tasted success in F1, yet have impressive records in other branches of motorsport.

It can't be an easy sell going to your board looking for a budget of ££££ to toll around as a midfielder when your mate who looks after the WTC programe is after a fracton of the amount and is still able to bring home the bacon.

The major teams, with the execption of Merc and Ferrari who see to be able to make something of F1 are better of as engine suppliers and spread there wares between teams. Works teams are better servered in WTC and GT programs where the cars the star, not the driver.

NASCAR is big enough and able to divide the fan base into sectons, Ford GM etc so the brand is recongised and linked to the driver, A bit like football, your a teams fan, not a players, but the players in that team are by default the best. When they move on you have decide to which you the greatest loyalty, team or driver.

That does not happen in to any great extent in Europeon racing.


All imho - I may be talking bollocks.

Well done Nordic, I think probably hit it on the screws pretty well.  And regarding NASCAR your right, its fan base is probably closer to that of a stick & ball league than any other discipline of motor racing, and to be honest that's one of the reasons its always driven me up a tree.  But yes, fan loyalty to a brand, team, or driver is everything in NASCAR.  The best example was at the end of last season when Tony Stewart left a very succesful relationship with Joe Gibbs and his Toyota backed team, to set up his own Chevy backed operation.  Left many fans of the partnership on the fence deciding who to stay loyal to.
Fax

Peter, I was at the Honda (now Brawn) F1 works in Brackley two years ago. I accidentally got detached from the tour party, got lost and ended up in the stationary cupboard. It looked exactly like your US F1 pictures. If that's all they've got on the techno front they'll be three seconds a lap behind Force India and Toro Rosso. And not a spare pencil sharpener in sight.

Saw a bit on Speed TV where Steve Matchet was given a quick tour around the new USF1 facility.  Oh dear, my local VW service garage looks more high tech than this cinder block, white-washed warehouse.  If I am one of the backers of this bunch I'm hanging onto my wallet with a death grip, Windsor's one of those characters who will disappear in the middle of the night and take the financial resources of the team with him.  The car they showed on the CAD screen bore a remarkable resemblance to a 2001 Williams.
Fax

Couldn't you catch up with the cupboards that were moving?

Groan  :-\ :)

It's the silly season, not the f**king ridiculous season.

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/154501/1/villeneuve_lotus_f1_interest_very_flattering.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMh3qu5GtZA

 ;D Yep, pretty well sums it up.  Good one Chop...
Fax

Rosberg confirmed for Mercedes.

Who'll get the second seat?

Is he that good?

Time will tell, but not been a huge fan tbh, he has been quicker than his team mate, but not by the huge margin I would expect.

Bets on Schuey?

Both at the same time?

its about time the schuey paid mercedes back for getting him into F1, & heidfeld,
try a punt on jamie green, or  Susie Stoddart , ;D ;D

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/8407138.stm

more news from renault.

Points make prize's
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/8407119.stm

Can they change their points for better items, like the good old "Green Sheild stamp days"   (http://www.coldal.org/images/remember/green-shield.jpg)

I Just heard Jenson talking on radio Five who was unaware of the proposal to change the points system. I find that quite odd.

Which?

Jenson talking, or the points system?  ::)

This could have be funny,

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/155481/1/branson_wanted_danica_to_be_a_virgin_in_f1_2010.html

"She is not only good and quick, she's a stunner."

Wrong and wrong.

She can't win (w/o a gift) in a low-skill formula, didn't win a race in Atlantics and she's ready for F1?  She makes Alex Yoong look like Fangio.  ::)

Looking forward to Fax's take on this bit of wisdom from Sir Richard.  ;D

Simply put, you've got to be f**king kidding!  Sir Richard is showing just how much he actually understands about motor racing.  Stick to running your piece of crap airline, and just write the checks.
Agreed Chop, she's made quite a living from stripping for mens magazine, but she has zilch for talent, she hadn't won a race since she was in karts, until Penske handed her a win a couple of years ago, as Chop said in a no talent, no credibilty series.
Fax
(I should add that she's not the least bit attractive, seen her several times in person and she looks like a small fifteen year old boy with long hair.  You can do wonders with photoshop and makeup)

1)  When you write the cheques, you buy the right to spout whatever bo**ox you want.  You just won't impress those who actually know.....

2)  Reality - driving ability gets you so far - if you are really good, then you become world champion.  Maybe.  PR does the rest. 


MG Mark

Your second point hits the mark perfectly when it comes to Indycar, its all about PR.  Most of the people racing in Indycar are a bunch of no-hopers essentially at their last stop before its time to find a real job.  When the "face" of your series is a nasty little bitch who's won one race since she was a kiddie racing karts, you've got a serious credibility issue.
Fax

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/formula_1/article6987180.ece

Bernie's short cut plan  ::)

News reaches me this morning via Twitter that the Big-Chinned German is complaining of neck pain after his GP2 test drives.

Time to roll out the spare driver....

*file this under "inevitable"*

This stuff is priceless, Schumacher's neck hurts? That never saw that coming eh ::)
Short cuts at tracks, maybe they can do a Ben Hur thing where spikes come out of the center of the wheels, or even better, heat seeking missles to take out the bloke in front of you.
Latest news is that Monza may be dropped in favor of a street race in Rome, you've got to be f**k*ng joking!
Once again, this is the sport that gave of Fangio, Moss, and Clark?
There was a dude at the Indy 500 this year who went to the Spanish GP with his father in the spring, said his pass for the weekend was $350 bucks, and a beer from the concession stand was $35 fricking dollars a pop!
Told the Mrs if I ever pay three hundred and fifty bucks to see anything, and thirty five for a beer while I'm there, its time to break out the home lobotomy kit.
Fax

Never mind Fax, your good old pal Peter Windsor at US F1 is about to unveil his hotshoe drivers for the 2010 season...  ;)

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/155821/1/usf1_admit_rookie_pay-driver_duo_likely_for_f1_2010.html

Shows the state of F1 in the US when the team that carries its name cant even attract a local pay driver.

Mind you I am amazed that any sane person would allow Windsor near $8 million of thier own money.

He still did 130 laps. He will be on track and whipping arse come the first race.

(that does not mean I like him!)

Some good ideas there FS, maybe to spice it up a bit a member of the public could be given a wild card entry and invited to drive?

Your right on both accounts Nordic, you'd have to be barking mad to let PW anywhere near your hard earned income, and yes, right about now F1 rates on the US sporting radar on a par with pro table tennis.
In all honesty, of all of the really talented young drivers in the US right, and there are a few good ones out there, Graham Rahal probably has the best shot at making it into F1 and having success.  However, he also has a damn good ride with Newman-Haas in Indycars, and would have no motivation whatsoever to get involved with some shady fly-by-night operation like USF1.  If something became available witha top team he might be tempted to give F1 a shot, but as with most of the top American drivers, why go abroad and put up with all of the bullshit you have to deal with in F1, to drive a grid filler car when he can make a damn good living racing at home and drive for a race winning team
Fax

Somewhere, I have a hazy and distant memory of days when chaps raced whatever came to hand every weekend, and that some bloke won (admittedly not in the same season) the F1 world championship, the Indy 500, and Le Mans.  Hill, I think his name was, and he's the only one to have done so, although Andretti Snr did try awfully hard to emulate him. 

Can't see anyone else hitting that mark, even "our Nige", or the German.... ;)

MG Mark       

Didn't his boy do a bit or car racing as well?

Our Nige did win the Cart championship in his rookie year, but I don't think he in with a chance of an outright win, but a class win would put him in second place :o

I think the German had a go at Le Mans, but a stray reflection from my beer bottle put him on the grass and he spun

Not quite sure where your going with that FS, the memories around the speedway of Graham Hill, Jimmy Clark, etc. are all very fond.  In fact Jimmy's 1965 winning Lotus 38 is sitting in the speedway museum right now (along with his '63 car and Graham Hill's 1968 Lotus 56 turbine)  Its interesting that the year Graham Hill won the 500, Jackie Stewart was well on his way to victory when his car expired a few laps from victory, and Jimmy Clark probably would have won but for a lap scoring error by the Lotus team.
Fax